magnus homestead Posted November 14, 2009 Report Share Posted November 14, 2009 I just finished the drawing for this shield bead - the client wanted a mountain lion and horse invoved in a Yin/Yang sort of relationship. I was going to put it in the "concept to finished work" category, but I don't know if people go there as often*. I'd love to get some feed back if any one has any comments - pros and cons, before I start carving. I am thinking of doing it in boxwood - 2inch diameter. Magnus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janel Posted November 14, 2009 Report Share Posted November 14, 2009 If you post it, they will read. Where ever it is posted. I'll move it if you wish... The creatures look comfortable with one another, not as predator and prey. The flow of the S made by the two creatures works and returns the eye to stay within the circle. For some reason, I feel the mass of the horse does not exceed that of the mountain lion and that maybe it should, with a shoulder or neck. The faces are beautiful. What are the eyes looking at, off to the left I wonder. Thank you for sharing the early step of the project. Janel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnus homestead Posted November 14, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2009 Hello Janel, Thank you - please move this to the proper place if you would. I appreciate your observations. I have been thinking just the same thing about the lack of mass with the horse ( I think it has even less than the puma ). As to the comfortable feeling between these animals - I tried several times to compose the lion attacking the horse and the horse in defense - it proved not to work without seeming contrived and awkward - i could'nt get the flow I wanted of Yin Yang balance. I let it go and just sketched without so much thought and came to this sort of "the lion lying down with the lamb" relationship. When I think of it - below the surface - predator and prey are kind of "One". Thanks again for your thoughtful response. It helps the process. Magnus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ford Posted November 14, 2009 Report Share Posted November 14, 2009 Hi Magnus, hisashiburi! as they say in Japan ( it's been a while) Intriguing concept... and one hard to do justice to...I like your take on it though. The only comment I'd offer would be with regard to the positioning of the 2 animals within your framework. I'd be inclined to leave all the "unused" space between the 2 heads so as to better express their essential divide and opposition. The negative space between them might even be worked so as to suggest the yin/yang interplay. Namaste, ford Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Debbie K Posted November 15, 2009 Report Share Posted November 15, 2009 Magnus: I like the interplay between the two, the "S" composition, and both glancing to their right. If I may presume to say, I am troubled by the visual weight of the lion at the top of the piece, more than it being bigger than the horse. I'm not sure that it would be resolved by making the horse bigger, that might result in the piece seeming too symetrical. Just my two cents worth, hope it doesn't give offense. I would like to let you know how much I appreciate seeing your work in progress, it is always extremely informative and fun to watch. I'll try to reciprocate on my next project from beginning to end. I've been too busy making a studio to do any work. (Nearly finished!) Debbie K Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnus homestead Posted November 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 16, 2009 Hello Ford!! So good to see you here. (I've had trouble getting my password to acess your site). Thank you Ford and Debbie for your remarks - I have to say it's quite new and awesome to have the insights and thoughtful input to a design process - I usually work in isolation so to speak. I have much to consider. Thanks again. Namaste, Magnus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janel Posted November 16, 2009 Report Share Posted November 16, 2009 When drawing a composition, one technique used to look for how the elements relate to one another, balance, weight... is to turn the composition upside down. The new view reveals a different relationship between the parts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil White Posted November 17, 2009 Report Share Posted November 17, 2009 Interesting, Janel Another technique is to look at it in a mirror. Magnus, is this intended to be done in low relief? Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Barnhill Posted November 17, 2009 Report Share Posted November 17, 2009 As a martial artist, I like the concept. Yin/yang represents good and evil, and dipicts that there is good and bad in all things. The lions claw on the horses back makes it look as though the lion has been distracted in mid attack by something it may be afraid of. But then that's just me and what do I know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnus homestead Posted November 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 17, 2009 Janel - that's pretty cool - really does allow a lot of "new" information to come into my awareness of the composition. The mirror effect, Phil, is also good - I practice squinting slightly out of focus at a piece also as a tenchnique to see the relationships - I have some good thoughts on possible adjustments to improve the strength of this piece - will post new drawing in a day or so. Phil - yes this is to be a fairly shallow relief with possibly pine branch border and an intertwined celtic version of the mountain lion and horse with teeth gripping legs, etc. on the reverse - I have liked this approach with some of the other animals I've done. Don -which martial art or arts do you practice? I used to do Karate Do but have switched to yoga and some simple Tai Chi over the years. As to the claws - I wanted to suggest the element of the predator but at the same time I wanted to get the eyes of both of these beautiful animals in full view, and the flow of the Yin Yang. I'm excited to see what comes of the next rendering. Thanks All, Magnus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ford Posted November 17, 2009 Report Share Posted November 17, 2009 Hi Don, Yin/yang represents good and evil, and dipicts that there is good and bad in all things. I think you may have misunderstood the concept and re-interpreted it in Judeo-Christian terms. There isn't actually a notion of absolute good and evil in Taoist thought ( which is where the symbol derives from) nor would things be defined in terms of good or bad. In fact, this is probably the single greatest difference between Western and Eastern religious and philosophical thought. For a fuller explanation of the philosophy you can check out wikipedia here, they seem to have got the gist of it from the wikipedia entry; The relationship between yin and yang is often described in terms of sunlight playing over a mountain and in the valley. Yin (literally the 'shady place' or 'north slope') is the dark area occluded by the mountain's bulk, while yang (literally the 'sunny place' or 'south slope') is the brightly lit portion. As the sun moves across the sky, yin and yang gradually trade places with each other, revealing what was obscured and obscuring what was revealed. Yin is usually characterized as slow, soft, insubstantial, diffuse, cold, wet, and tranquil. It is generally associated with the feminine, birth and generation, and with the night. Yang, by contrast, is characterized as fast, hard, solid, dry, focused, hot, and aggressive. It is associated with masculinity and daytime respectfully, ford Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnus homestead Posted November 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 17, 2009 Ford, I like what you just added - it's rather what I was coming to in my feeling the "oneness" in the predator/prey relationship - it is the interplay of the physical universe - it can not be "bad" or "good". But it is AWESOME! Magnus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Barnhill Posted November 19, 2009 Report Share Posted November 19, 2009 Magnus, I hope I didn't offend you with my thoughts. Certainly wasn't my intention. Anyway, I too would like to see how this evolves. As for my Martial Arts, I have been teaching for about 30 years. My first discipline was Sum Lum Fa (Young Forest), Kung Fu, my second was Wu Chen (Five Animal), Kung Fu, and I now practice Chinese Kempo (Fist Way) Karate. Su Lum Fa - second degree Black Sash Wu Chen - third degree black sash Chinese Kempo - fifth degree black belt. I am now 63 years old and have some physical problems such as a bad hip, back and knee. I still teach two nights a week at my studio which I have owned for about fifteen years. The Dragon Martial Arts Center. I have incorporated the circular moves of Kung Fu into the Karate system. I also teach Chin'a or wrist locking which is very similar to Aikido. But enough about my karate. Please post photo's of the finished product so I can see the results of your design as it evolves into a finished piece. And thanks for allowing us to share with you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Barnhill Posted November 19, 2009 Report Share Posted November 19, 2009 Ford, Mine was a simplistic view. Thanks for sharing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnus homestead Posted November 19, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 19, 2009 Don, No you didn't offend in the slightest - thanks for your posts. Blessings, Magnus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Clive Posted November 19, 2009 Report Share Posted November 19, 2009 Magnus.. I noticed earlier you mentioned the relationship between lion and horse.. is there any particular characterics of each that you'd relate to either yin or the yang.. Regards Clive - Black belt in origami. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnus homestead Posted November 20, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 Clive, Thanks for the question. I have been having more and more feelings/images/fleeting thoughts this week about this project . . brought on by the responses from members here. I have only just been thinking about how shallow, in a way, my understanding of Yin and Yang has been. I was considering the very thing you brought up in regard to the animals here. I also have been having a feeling of perhaps doing this as a ryusa with the cat in the shadows of a pine that the horse is walking by. In that image the cat would seem the yin or dark, soft and feminine while the horse is in the bright light with hard hooves on the rocks - more yang. I just finished a custom piece and delivered so I am going to take some time tonight to see what appears on paper with the puma and horse - guess it's to be a stallion now . . . perhaps. Magnus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Clive Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 I was also thinking in terms of masculinity/femininity.. if one considers the hunter as female.. as in the mother lion hunting to feed her cubs.. and the horse if it was a stallion as very masculine.. theres a nice bit of duality at play... which makes me think the negative spaces of your design could be very important to an expression of that and perhaps a ryusa would facilitate that... (?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil White Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 Magnus, Your thought on doing this in high relief is what I was getting at with my question. I just haven't been able to get to spend too much time on the forum over the last few days. Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dante lopez Posted November 26, 2009 Report Share Posted November 26, 2009 magnus ,I think that after all this things that others bring to you ,it will be a lovely piece ,that's one of reason I join here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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